Is National Youth Action only quick rated?

[sloan]

.... Yet more evidence that the TD option to "compensate" for the delay is a rule that has outlived it's purpose. It now does more harm than good (in my opinion).

Amen -- most of the time.

But there is still the Steve Immitt problem, of how to get in 4 rounds of regular-rated play on a weeknight without making players miss their trains home.

Or the Ken Sloan problem: I'd like to run 6 rounds at G/15 and call it "Regular". For some reason, there's a rule against that.

[Grant Perks]

I fail to see where stating that G/25+5 is dual rated is any more confusing than stating that G/30 is dual rated. Actually, from reading the OP and some of the subsequent posts this would possibly be less confusing.

I am very comfortable using an analog clock in time controls greater than G/45. I recently purchased a Heuer Chess Champion and have used it in G/75 and 40/90, sd/60 games. At G/30 while I prefer to use time delay I will leave the delay capable clock at home if I know the TD is going to impose a penalty on games that use time delay.

Since I play in Steve's weeknight G/30's when I am in NY, I understand his concerns. I generally will take a last round bye just to get home at a reasonable hour. Having to play for another half hour past the current normal end time could be a deal breaker for many of the players in his events.

Making G/25+5 dual rated will end the duel and confusion over the time deduction. We will also see fewer analog clocks in use. Then we could do away with 14(H).

[Smythe Dakota]

I think verifying your proposed rules would be complicated, and explaining them unambiguously to organizers .... may be even more complicated.

Couldn't be any more complicated than the present rules! At present, as I recall, there is a situation where a certain time control is regular-ratable OR quick-ratable, but not dual-ratable (or something like that).

Bill Smythe

[nolan]

Not sure what you're referring to, Bill. The current rules are IMHO unambiguous.

The following applies to the advertised time control, ignoring any adjustment of clock time based the type of clock being used.

1. If the total time per player is less than 5 minutes, the event is NOT RATABLE.
2. If there are 16 or more seconds of increment or delay, the event is REGULAR RATED ONLY.
3. If the total time per player is 61 minutes or longer, the event is REGULAR RATED ONLY.
4. If the total time per player is at least 5 minutes but less than 30 minutes, the event is QUICK RATED ONLY.
5. If none of the above apply (which also means that the total time per player is between 30 and 60 minutes, inclusively), the event is DUAL RATED.

These are the rules, though organizers and/or TDs seem to be very creative about interpreting them. There are also organizers and/or TDs who have admitted mis-reporting the time control in order to get an event rated under a specific rating system.

[anjiaoshi]

I am very comfortable using an analog clock in time controls greater than G/45. I recently purchased a Heuer Chess Champion and have used it in G/75 and 40/90, sd/60 games. At G/30 while I prefer to use time delay I will leave the delay capable clock at home if I know the TD is going to impose a penalty on games that use time delay.

Who imposes penalties on games that use time delay? If there's any prevailing bias out there, it's against games that don't (e.g., the "digital is always preferred over analog" rule, not to mention suggestions that a G/30 game should give you 30 minutes if you have an analog clock and 30 minutes plus delay time galore if you're digital).

[sloan]

I fail to see where stating that G/25+5 is dual rated is any more confusing than stating that G/30 is dual rated.

It's confusing because according to the rules, G/25 with a 5 second delay is NOT ratable under the Regular rating system.

It's always "confusing" to make false statements.

[Smythe Dakota]

.... Who imposes penalties on games that use time delay? If there's any prevailing bias out there, it's against games that don't (e.g., the "digital is always preferred over analog" rule ....

To be sure, the bias within USCF is to prefer delay over non-delay. However, this thread started out discussing the bias within FIDE to prefer increment over delay. It's a completely different horse.

Bill Smythe

[Grant Perks]

It's confusing because according to the rules, G/25 with a 5 second delay is NOT ratable under the Regular rating system.

It's always "confusing" to make false statements.

I understand that. My post was in response to Mr. Nolan's statement that the proposed change to allow G/25 with a 5 second delay would add confusion.

[nolan]

What happens, Grant, when a tournament is advertised as G/25+5s delay and someone shows up without a delay-capable clock? How much time does that person get? If it is less than 30 minutes, then it doesn't seem reasonable to dual-rate that event.

BTW, Bill, THIS thread started out talking about the National Youth Action, another thread was talking about FIDE issues.

[Akzidenz]

Making G/25+5 dual rated will end the duel and confusion over the time deduction. We will also see fewer analog clocks in use. Then we could do away with 14(H).

Ummmm...what about those of us who are happily running g/29 delay 3 tournaments, quick-rated only? Don't you go messing us up, OK?

As a side note and a consideration for future years, it might be an asset, not a liaibility, for the NYA to be quick-rated, as I don't believe the USCF has a youth championship that is quick-rated only.

But I (and my kid chess player, who refuses to play g/30) are in the minority on that. Most kids like g/30 and it's a popular scholastic format in these parts.

[bioniclime]

Not sure what you're referring to, Bill. The current rules are IMHO unambiguous.

The following applies to the advertised time control, ignoring any adjustment of clock time based the type of clock being used.

1. If the total time per player is less than 5 minutes, the event is NOT RATABLE.
2. If there are 16 or more seconds of increment or delay, the event is REGULAR RATED ONLY.
3. If the total time per player is 61 minutes or longer, the event is REGULAR RATED ONLY.
4. If the total time per player is at least 5 minutes but less than 30 minutes, the event is QUICK RATED ONLY.
5. If none of the above apply (which also means that the total time per player is between 30 and 60 minutes, inclusively), the event is DUAL RATED.

These are the rules, though organizers and/or TDs seem to be very creative about interpreting them. There are also organizers and/or TDs who have admitted mis-reporting the time control in order to get an event rated under a specific rating system.

Am I misinterpreting something? If it is a 20 minutes + a 20 second delay, by (2) it is REGULAR only, but by (4) it is QUICK only. What am I missing?

[nolan]

The first rule that applies is as far as you need to go.

[glennpan]

Can we please change the name of this thread? Or at least split it off. This thread ceased being about the NYA quite some time ago.

[chesschick]

Not sure what you're referring to, Bill. The current rules are IMHO unambiguous.

The following applies to the advertised time control, ignoring any adjustment of clock time based the type of clock being used.

1. If the total time per player is less than 5 minutes, the event is NOT RATABLE.

Unless you are WCL and running an Online Grand Prix, then you can rate blitz with a G/3 with 2 sec time delay as quick.

[nolan]

Is WCL still doing that? I guess that falls under the 'golden rule'.